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Post by ayla on Dec 19, 2022 16:10:58 GMT -5
Why put chosen in quotes? I put it in quotes because, again speaking philosophically here, his choice to take this action (whatever it was) comes from a mental state which was neither chosen nor (currently) changeable. It’s not as if he saw all the great perks of disabled life and said, yep, that’s for me! Or picked a disability that would be most likely to garner pity or resources…etc. Why would anyone go through so much hassle to specifically have partial paralysis on the right side, if they had any real choice in the matter? Surely it would be far better to be in sync with one’s body as is, if that were an option?
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Post by shadow on Dec 19, 2022 16:13:13 GMT -5
I absolutely do not receive any social services or charitable help for disabled people. That would certainly be crossing a line for me. Again, I have very strong personal ethical boundaries in this realm and would rather go without than take up resources in an area where there are already limited resources for disabled people, or cause harm by projecting my own experience over anyone else's. I just wanted to point out that if you’re using a wheelchair 90% of the time, you are still taking resources from other people. Maybe not monetary services, but wheelchair parking is limited, wheelchair seating at venues is limited, elevator space is limited, accessible restrooms are limited. These are things that make everyday life more difficult to other people who use wheelchairs. I’m not saying I don’t think you should use those resources, some of those resources should be available for anyone who needs them regardless how they became to need them. Some people have argued that morbidly obese people with limited mobility, for one example, are choosing to be disabled and using resources, so is disability due to biid any different? The ethical dilemma is a tough one, but I don’t think you should see it as not taking any of the limited resources. I won’t give my opinion on the ethics of it. I respect that you didn’t come here to be judged on who/what you are and just want to get to know people. I do appreciate your being upfront about it, you didn’t have to disclose it. Personally, anyone who is disabled as result of self injury from biid would not tick any of the boxes of my dev attraction/interest. I would view it similarly to someone who uses a wheelchair due to COPD, obesity or old age- yes there is a physical limitation, but I wouldn't view it as a disability that triggers any dev emotion in me. Your link above does not work, do you have any other links? I’d be curious to what type of research has been done on self injury and the outcomes of it. Of the people Ive known with biid (none self injured-pretenders only), in the end they mainly want their mobility to be altered. None have ever wanted things like losing their bladder, bowel or sexual function along with their sci. If you ask someone with a real sci, 99% of the time you’ll hear that the lack of walking and the use of the wheelchair is the “easiest” part of the disability. If this is going beyond your comfort you don’t have to answer, but I’m curious what are your thoughts on the ability to pick and choose the severity of the disability and it’s representation of being an authentic disability? If you can pick the limitations, is it an authentic experience? No person who breaks their neck or contracts polio can decide which funcitons they want to remain in tact, whereas you could. Is it the same? Or do you see it as disability with an asterisk?
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queerwheels
New Member
Posts: 25
Gender: Non-binary
Dev Status: BIID
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Post by queerwheels on Dec 19, 2022 18:36:44 GMT -5
I believe your experiences, but I think that the choices you made in regard to them are overstepping all kinds of lines all over the place. The choices I made with regards to my body are not affecting anyone else. It is not possible for what I do to my body in the privacy of my own home to cross someone else's boundaries. Btw just want to mention to the other folks in this thread that I use they/them pronouns, not he/him.
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queerwheels
New Member
Posts: 25
Gender: Non-binary
Dev Status: BIID
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Post by queerwheels on Dec 19, 2022 18:54:14 GMT -5
I absolutely do not receive any social services or charitable help for disabled people. That would certainly be crossing a line for me. Again, I have very strong personal ethical boundaries in this realm and would rather go without than take up resources in an area where there are already limited resources for disabled people, or cause harm by projecting my own experience over anyone else's. I just wanted to point out that if you’re using a wheelchair 90% of the time, you are still taking resources from other people. Maybe not monetary services, but wheelchair parking is limited, wheelchair seating at venues is limited, elevator space is limited, accessible restrooms are limited. These are things that make everyday life more difficult to other people who use wheelchairs. I’m not saying I don’t think you should use those resources, some of those resources should be available for anyone who needs them regardless how they became to need them. Some people have argued that morbidly obese people with limited mobility, for one example, are choosing to be disabled and using resources, so is disability due to biid any different? The ethical dilemma is a tough one, but I don’t think you should see it as not taking any of the limited resources. I won’t give my opinion on the ethics of it. I respect that you didn’t come here to be judged on who/what you are and just want to get to know people. I do appreciate your being upfront about it, you didn’t have to disclose it. Personally, anyone who is disabled as result of self injury from biid would not tick any of the boxes of my dev attraction/interest. I would view it similarly to someone who uses a wheelchair due to COPD, obesity or old age- yes there is a physical limitation, but I wouldn't view it as a disability that triggers any dev emotion in me. Your link above does not work, do you have any other links? I’d be curious to what type of research has been done on self injury and the outcomes of it. Of the people Ive known with biid (none self injured-pretenders only), in the end they mainly want their mobility to be altered. None have ever wanted things like losing their bladder, bowel or sexual function along with their sci. If you ask someone with a real sci, 99% of the time you’ll hear that the lack of walking and the use of the wheelchair is the “easiest” part of the disability. If this is going beyond your comfort you don’t have to answer, but I’m curious what are your thoughts on the ability to pick and choose the severity of the disability and it’s representation of being an authentic disability? If you can pick the limitations, is it an authentic experience? No person who breaks their neck or contracts polio can decide which funcitons they want to remain in tact, whereas you could. Is it the same? Or do you see it as disability with an asterisk? To be honest, I think bringing up elevators, restrooms, etc. is a bit silly. These are things I use for maybe 5 minutes at most. I don't think it's what people are worried about when they refer to limited resources for disabled people. I don't drive, and I have yet to attend an event with specific wheelchair seating since I started using a wheelchair, but I will keep that in mind if I do. Sorry, the prior link seems to have included the end parenthesis in it - delete the parenthesis and it should work. Re: your last question, it's certainly complicated. I definitely do know BIID people who include lack of bladder and bowel function in their desired body image, or post-injury sequelae of deafness, blindness, etc. However, I will point out that without getting into the details of self-harm, taking that route does not allow one to pick and choose. This is not something many people do at all. It is significant trauma to the body, in any way that it's being done, and I've always felt that it's the last resort for those who are unable to cope with the dysphoria or the thought of living with it for the rest of one's life. It's not done lightly, and it is done with the understanding that one cannot pick and choose the effects nor the unintended consequences, and it's not possible to go back. I would not at all characterize it as choosing the "easiest" parts. Also, the vast majority of people with BID do not self-injure.
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Post by Dani on Dec 19, 2022 19:15:26 GMT -5
I won’t give my opinion on the ethics of it. I respect that you didn’t come here to be judged on who/what you are and just want to get to know people. I do appreciate your being upfront about it, you didn’t have to disclose it. Personally, anyone who is disabled as result of self injury from biid would not tick any of the boxes of my dev attraction/interest. I would view it similarly to someone who uses a wheelchair due to COPD, obesity or old age- yes there is a physical limitation, but I wouldn't view it as a disability that triggers any dev emotion in me. I feel the same as shadow about BIID acquired or connected disability; it doesn't trigger anything related to my devness or my attraction to men with certain disabilities. Unfortunately, in the past, as a devotee, I've often experienced that people with BIID seem to want to connect with me merely to have their "disability" validated and that is not something I want to do or even feel inclined to do. A lot of psychological factors play into BIID and honestly, I don't want to deal with it and I also don't want to be used as a validation or confirmation.
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Post by ayla on Dec 19, 2022 19:30:09 GMT -5
I believe your experiences, but I think that the choices you made in regard to them are overstepping all kinds of lines all over the place. The choices I made with regards to my body are not affecting anyone else. It is not possible for what I do to my body in the privacy of my own home to cross someone else's boundaries. Btw just want to mention to the other folks in this thread that I use they/them pronouns, not he/him. My bad with the pronouns; it’s just that traditionally this has been a site for male pwd and devs of any gender, so I am not accustomed to checking. No insult intended!
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Post by devogirl on Dec 19, 2022 19:48:24 GMT -5
Let's be clear: BIID and pretenders are allowed to join and are items in the drop-down menu to discourage lying or creating accounts under false identities. This board is not for BIID people or BIID discussions. This is not a BIID safe space, and anyone who joins can expect pushback on this topic. Every time a BIID person joins, this exact same argument starts up as if it had never happened before, as if everyone were discovering these points for the first time. It's tiresome.
This is what I see as the main problem here:
when someone I'm seeing just ignores the disability, it feels wrong somehow. I would love to get to know someone who actually takes in and appreciates my disability, who understands the fact that it is inherently an important part of me - although in a different way than for most disabled people, and who maybe even finds it attractive as a part of me.
Sorry to break it to you, but this is not going to happen here. On the whole, devs do not find a BIID self-injury attractive, as several members in this thread have already stated. Please let go of the fantasy that a dev is the perfect partner.
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queerwheels
New Member
Posts: 25
Gender: Non-binary
Dev Status: BIID
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Post by queerwheels on Dec 19, 2022 21:16:39 GMT -5
If it's tiresome to see the same arguments over and over, maybe don't engage in arguments. I'm not here to pick fights, nor do I care about receiving validation from external parties. Fair enough that devs aren't attracted to BID folks; still just here to get to know people and make friends on my own terms. I'm not claiming to be anything I'm not. If you're not interested in being friends, please just leave me alone.
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realpara48
New Member
Posts: 32
Gender: Male
Dev Status: Disabled
Relationship Status: Single
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Post by realpara48 on Dec 20, 2022 5:49:43 GMT -5
Sorry but as someone that had an accident a left a para , I find this disgusting that you feel you are disabled.
I think you need help big time .
Who the f**k wants to be disabled?
If this forum is allowing this bullshit then I’m off it’s degrading to gen disabled .
It’s wrong on so many levels
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Post by infinatedreams on Dec 20, 2022 8:20:27 GMT -5
If it's tiresome to see the same arguments over and over, maybe don't engage in arguments. I'm not here to pick fights, nor do I care about receiving validation from external parties. Fair enough that devs aren't attracted to BID folks; still just here to get to know people and make friends on my own terms. But you are seeking validation .... youre very first post you said 'I would love to get to know someone who actually takes in and appreciates my disability, who understands the fact that it is inherently an important part of me' It seems already the devs here have made their views clear on that point As for making friends, thats going to be tough, the disabled dudes will react in a range of 'oh for fucks sake not another one' to absolute disgust and everything inbetween. So im not sure what the value or benefit of you on this board is going to bring you. My initial reaction to 'partial paralysis primerily in right leg ' was .... thats not a disability its a fucking limp, might sound harsh but as a complete para ill stick with that. Its like 'your brain' wants you to be able to 'look disabled' therefore you 'are' disabled and claim to be but without all the shit that comes with a severe disability or complete paralysis. Oh and whilst im at it, partial paralysis and can walk but then use a chair 90% of the time, wtf is all that about. Get a leg brace(s) and no need for the chair, I know that may not be the 'look' you want but wheeling round in a chair for the rest of your life will fuck you up more than walking. realpara48 dont lose your shit over this or let it drive you away. It happens occasionaly, just ignore. Theres a cool bunch of disabled dudes here and some devs who are all well worth getting to know. A few hot and feisty devs in the UK ... so ive heard 😉
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Post by AlrightyAphrodite on Dec 20, 2022 8:43:57 GMT -5
Sorry but as someone that had an accident a left a para , I find this disgusting that you feel you are disabled. I think you need help big time . Who the f**k wants to be disabled? If this forum is allowing this bullshit then I’m off it’s degrading to gen disabled . It’s wrong on so many levels A number of us are not fans of folks with BIID on the board (me) but trying to "not allow" them is impossible and more trouble than it's worth. I prefer to generally ignore what I don't want to engage with. I agree with Dani that I kind of feel like this OP is baiting to get a dev to validate their "disability" and in this space that feels squicky to me, I don't like it, I don't think this forum is the place. My two cents.
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Post by Green on Dec 20, 2022 10:15:50 GMT -5
Why would anyone go through so much hassle to specifically have partial paralysis on the right side, if they had any real choice in the matter? Surely it would be far better to be in sync with one’s body as is, if that were an option? I don't know, but someone with serious psychological problems would do some pretty wild and irrational things to accomplish a sense of comfort. Sometimes, feeling out of sync is the better option, although it certainly isn't the easier option. Healthwise, becoming disabled makes you worse off, not just different. For a lot of identities, none of them are superior to another, just different. Psychological distress is real, and pose real problems to people, but grabbing a hammer and smashing your leg because it is more comforting is more like giving into psychological distress rather than attempting to overcome it.
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queerwheels
New Member
Posts: 25
Gender: Non-binary
Dev Status: BIID
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Post by queerwheels on Dec 20, 2022 10:40:41 GMT -5
If it's tiresome to see the same arguments over and over, maybe don't engage in arguments. I'm not here to pick fights, nor do I care about receiving validation from external parties. Fair enough that devs aren't attracted to BID folks; still just here to get to know people and make friends on my own terms. But you are seeking validation .... youre very first post you said 'I would love to get to know someone who actually takes in and appreciates my disability, who understands the fact that it is inherently an important part of me' It seems already the devs here have made their views clear on that point As for making friends, thats going to be tough, the disabled dudes will react in a range of 'oh for fucks sake not another one' to absolute disgust and everything inbetween. So im not sure what the value or benefit of you on this board is going to bring you. My initial reaction to 'partial paralysis primerily in right leg ' was .... thats not a disability its a fucking limp, might sound harsh but as a complete para ill stick with that. Its like 'your brain' wants you to be able to 'look disabled' therefore you 'are' disabled and claim to be but without all the shit that comes with a severe disability or complete paralysis. Oh and whilst im at it, partial paralysis and can walk but then use a chair 90% of the time, wtf is all that about. Get a leg brace(s) and no need for the chair, I know that may not be the 'look' you want but wheeling round in a chair for the rest of your life will fuck you up more than walking. realpara48 dont lose your shit over this or let it drive you away. It happens occasionaly, just ignore. Theres a cool bunch of disabled dudes here and some devs who are all well worth getting to know. A few hot and feisty devs in the UK ... so ive heard 😉 Validation would be me not being secure in myself and needing someone else to help me overcome insecurity. I said I would love someone who appreciates a part of me that I'm already quite comfortable with. If you're going to gatekeep and say anything less than complete paralysis isn't a disability, that's not going to serve you well. I guarantee many people who have involuntarily developed disabilities may have partial paralysis, or conditions primarily affecting one leg more than the other, can walk somewhat, and yet use wheelchairs for longer distances.
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queerwheels
New Member
Posts: 25
Gender: Non-binary
Dev Status: BIID
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Post by queerwheels on Dec 20, 2022 10:41:42 GMT -5
Why would anyone go through so much hassle to specifically have partial paralysis on the right side, if they had any real choice in the matter? Surely it would be far better to be in sync with one’s body as is, if that were an option? I don't know, but someone with serious psychological problems would do some pretty wild and irrational things to accomplish a sense of comfort. Sometimes, feeling out of sync is the better option, although it certainly isn't the easier option. Healthwise, becoming disabled makes you worse off, not just different. For a lot of identities, none of them are superior to another, just different. Psychological distress is real, and pose real problems to people, but grabbing a hammer and smashing your leg because it is more comforting is more like giving into psychological distress rather than attempting to overcome it. Would you say the same thing about transgender people?
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queerwheels
New Member
Posts: 25
Gender: Non-binary
Dev Status: BIID
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Post by queerwheels on Dec 20, 2022 11:13:41 GMT -5
Sorry but as someone that had an accident a left a para , I find this disgusting that you feel you are disabled. I think you need help big time . Who the f**k wants to be disabled? If this forum is allowing this bullshit then I’m off it’s degrading to gen disabled . It’s wrong on so many levels You're right. It is fucked up. It is disgusting. It is not something most people would consider in their lifetimes. Can you then imagine the level of mental distress and turmoil that someone would experience if their brain was telling them, constantly, every hour and every minute of every day, that their body should be disabled? Can you imagine what might drive someone to do that to themselves? I assure you it's not a whim or a choice or something done lightly. These is research out there showing scientific evidence for BID as a dysphoric condition of brain-body mapping, akin to (though not identical to) being transgender. I've been in therapy for years and if there was a way I could have continued to cope with my condition, I would have sought it out. I'm not hiding from people that I became disabled through voluntary actions as a result of BID. But I am not hurting you by existing as I am.
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