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Post by andyc251 on Aug 7, 2008 0:04:30 GMT -5
So, the all wise and moral superpower that is the catholic church has just refused to marry an Italian couple when the priest found out that the groom-to-be was paraplegic and therefore impotent. The reasoning behind this decision is that the couple would not be able to procreate and therefore the wedding would not be within catholic guidelines. The purpose of marriage is to produce children. www.topnews.in/bishop-denies-impotent-paraplegic-church-wedding-246418Apparently this wasn't just some over zealous local priest deciding to interpret the bible in his own way (like that NEVER happens) but came down as an order from above that he was not to perform the ceremony. The couple went ahead and got married in a civil ceremony, which the priest attended (cheeky bastard). I doubt it's possible, but hopefully this guy will sue the crap out of the vatican in someway for discrimination. Shouldn't be too hard to prove, by the churches reasoning any marriage where either the husband or wife is sterile, or otherwise unable to conceive naturally, shouldn't be allowed to take place, and any current marriages of this type should be immediately annulled. In-fact any marriages that haven't produced children must surely be null and void too. Obviously the vatican must be willing to bring in fertility testing as pre-wedding criteria to make sure no-one else gets married that isn't likely to increase the churches population. On a lighter note:
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Post by Triassic on Aug 7, 2008 5:12:38 GMT -5
an interesting point, or question. my understanding of catholic teaching is that the only permitted sexual activity at all is that which can-at least in potential-lead to fertilization; and that ONLY within the bounds of wedlock, to one's spouse. thus-penile/vaginal intercourse,with no mechanical or chemical barriers to pregnancy, between husband and wife is IT(however...you can do AS MUCH of it as you like). haha...the reason for this is that all sexual activity that can't lead to the birth of a child of a married couple is 'concupiscience'; negativistic sensual indulgence which is sinful. so i geuss the idea behind this ruling is that since 'normal' procreative sex will be impossible, there's no grounds for a marriage to occur. but i'd geuss someone in the church heirarchy is being overzealous...there's almost certainly a loophole in church law that would allow it. i have a friend from childhood who's a priest. i'll ask him.
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Post by Triassic on Aug 7, 2008 5:27:33 GMT -5
yeah..i just read the article a little more closely; the problem is that impotence is grounds for annulment of a catholic marriage. if for centuries people have been having marriages annuled BECAUSE of impotence, how can an ackowledgedly impotent man be allowed to GET married?? but then...how does the chuch even know for sure he's impotent? i mean, i don't think all grooms have to go before a panel of priests for a 'stiffy test'. before being allowed to marry. (some of those padres would dig THAT ). no the church just should have not inquired so closely into the question. obviously if the priest attended their civil union, he was on their side.
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Post by genuinejoe76 on Aug 7, 2008 8:28:05 GMT -5
The Vatican should stop worrying about other people getting laid and worry more about legalizing sexual relations/marriages for their Priests. Maybe then we won't have all these perverted, child molesters seeking protection under the umbrella of Catholicism.
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Post by Ouch on Aug 7, 2008 12:24:35 GMT -5
...another reason for me not to go to church...
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2008 17:47:28 GMT -5
I heard about this when it happened. I was pretty pissed off then I realized I have never given a rat's ass about what the Vatican and catholic church had to say. All those fuckers know how to do is judge and teach others to judge so fuck em!
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Post by matisse on Aug 7, 2008 21:04:08 GMT -5
The percentage of priests involved in those allegations was so small as to be statistically insignificant. What's the percentage you're referring to--percentage of child molesters who are priests, percentage of priests who are child molesters, or something else?
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Post by matisse on Aug 7, 2008 21:35:58 GMT -5
What's the percentage you're referring to--percentage of child molesters who are priests, percentage of priests who are child molesters, or something else? Percentage of priests who were accused of child molesting. As in, if you meet 100 priests, there's a huge chance that all of them are not child molesters. Any stats on the number of victims per molester? Seems to me that's something you have to take into account in conjunction with just the % of priests among priests.
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Post by Triassic on Aug 8, 2008 4:08:18 GMT -5
i can attest that catholicism can work really well as a way of life. i grew up across the street from a big catholic family. the house was pervaded with a catholic atmosphere, and it always felt really nice over there; safe, peaceful, calm(even somehow w/5 kids running around), loving. they had problems like anyone, but the church WORKED for them.
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Post by Triassic on Aug 8, 2008 4:14:02 GMT -5
jason-i think in britain you CAN sue a private institution for discrimination. brits seem to tolerate much greater intrusion into their private lives-being told what they can and can't do- than do americans
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Post by Triassic on Aug 8, 2008 8:15:51 GMT -5
jason is right that the percentage of abusive priests is miniscule. but matisse's point is well taken, too. these guys didnt just diddle one or two kids once or twice-not that ANY sexual abuse is ok-but dozens, scores of them, over decades. they were just passed from parish to parish, rather than defrocked and punished....but this can happen in any organization where individuals are given power and control over youth. i've heard rumors that similar stuff happens in orthodox jewish communities.
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Post by Ouch on Aug 8, 2008 18:30:02 GMT -5
Abuse of the powers of any institution is prevalent among multiple aspects of society, not just limited to the church, or even relgion in general. Such is the same with ignorance...
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Post by natasha on Aug 8, 2008 18:51:25 GMT -5
Interesting to see how still these days those kind of ignorant doctrines are going on in some parts! They forgot the part were it says that God love us all the same, etc.... It made me laugh the part were it says that the bride was aware of the groom impotence!! WTF
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Post by matisse on Aug 9, 2008 11:25:29 GMT -5
jason-i think in britain you CAN sue a private institution for discrimination. You can here too. But suing the church for this type of thing would be odd. I mean, it's their club, it's their rules. It's not like they are depriving you of any legal right, you can just go out and get married anyway, like they did.
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Post by matisse on Aug 9, 2008 11:32:23 GMT -5
jason is right that the percentage of abusive priests is miniscule. but matisse's point is well taken, too. these guys didnt just diddle one or two kids once or twice-not that ANY sexual abuse is ok-but dozens, scores of them, over decades. they were just passed from parish to parish, rather than defrocked and punished....but this can happen in any organization where individuals are given power and control over youth. i've heard rumors that similar stuff happens in orthodox jewish communities. Yeah, and haven't they paid out a couple billion dollars? I don't think you can pay out $2 billion and consider the issue to be insignificant. The other thing is that these guys should be the most trusted people in society, much more than teachers, with whom they are often compared. It is a breach of trust at the most fundamental level, even deeper than the husband/wife level, according to their teachings.
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