KingRichard
Full Member
Posts: 200
Gender: Male
Dev Status: Disabled Male
Relationship Status: Single
|
Post by KingRichard on Jun 24, 2020 14:30:48 GMT -5
I'm definitely not relationship material, and this is definitely one of the reasons. My self-doubt about my disability would ultimately probably be too much for most to handle, including devs. So, I just accept that about me and find other ways to feel fulfilled in life. This is why it has taken me so long to get back on the dating scene again I have only been on the dating scene for about a year and I felt it was the right time to make a comeback you need to be in the right mindset to be able to date people and to form relationships and my past me would have only taken out my problems on my other half which is something I don't want to put anybody thought which is why I have been single for so long
|
|
|
Post by Braced4Impact on Jun 24, 2020 14:43:04 GMT -5
I'm definitely not relationship material, and this is definitely one of the reasons. My self-doubt about my disability would ultimately probably be too much for most to handle, including devs. So, I just accept that about me and find other ways to feel fulfilled in life. This is why it has taken me so long to get back on the dating scene again I have only been on the dating scene for about a year and I felt it was the right time to make a comeback you need to be in the right mindset to be able to date people and to form relationships and my past me would have only taken out my problems on my other half which is something I don't want to put anybody thought why is why I have been single for so long I doubt I'll ever be in that mindset, but I came to terms with it long ago and made my peace with it. It's one thing to be lonely, it's another to seek solitude.
|
|
cripman33
Junior Member
Posts: 91
Gender: Male
Dev Status: Disabled Male
|
Post by cripman33 on Jun 24, 2020 16:43:29 GMT -5
This is such an interesting thread.
Being able to accept love from someone else necessarily means loving one's self first. Maybe this has been said already, but I think it bears repeating: PWDs (at least those of us with lifelong disabilities) are not taught to love ourselves. Quite the opposite, in fact. Instead of being taught how to truly accept our disabilities we are taught to do everything in our power to minimize it; even ignore it entirely. The "don't let your disability define you" narrative is one of the most toxic -- yet widely pervasive -- narratives fed to us. My disability has to define me. Not always, but sometimes. That's where the narrative's toxicity comes in: your disability will define you at times. But you feel like a failure and an even bigger pariah when it does because that was your one thing: "I may not be able to do a lot, but I'll be damned if I let this disability get the best of me." We're set up to fail from the start and it's a self-perpetuating cycle that is just...so incredibly difficult to get oneself out of.
I've been in therapy for over a year now, and though I can now identify the toxicity and flaws in the way I was raised, I still don't love myself. I often wonder if I ever will.
Also, please forgive me for speaking in generalities. I know everyone has different stories and experiences. I am simply speaking from my own and a number of PWDs who I have spoken to about this.
|
|
|
Post by IcarusFellOnce on Jun 28, 2020 12:48:41 GMT -5
Everyone is a 'burden' in some way or the other. I'm a fair handful in any relationship, just ask my exs And people do feel like they are a 'burden' on others justifiably or not. Having a disability just makes it super obvious, but that doesn't mean that the not-so-obvious things that people don't like about themselves are any less of a 'burden' in a relationship. I mean, take any kind of insecurity as an example, sooner or later the partner has to bear the consequences of someone's insecurity. Sometimes we all just need to say to ourselves "Get over yourself" and have a laugh. Also, trust that if the partner found it to be a 'burden' they'd leave. Everyone is an adult capable of making decisions. AGREE 110% with this sentiment. That was one of the lessons I had to learn as a new injury. Part of rebuilding my life was dating around. And I was no slouch when I first got injured. I wasn't a slouch before I got hurt so I brought that confidence and swag to the game. Would DEFINITELY surprise some girls... I remember one girl I was dating in particular was just staring at me while we were at a low key bar.. like she was just thinking something.. so she asked... "What makes you so confident? Why do you think so much of yourself?" I smirked... it was annoying. Thought to myself, "Never have been asked that before the injury.. but now that I'm in a chair someone like you that was a pot head ski bum turned orthotist FINALLY later in life AFTER you got your shit together with her own issues is going to ask me that... WHY.. because I'm in a chair?" Just smirked and answered, "When you've done half the shit that I have done in life.. when you work hard and graduate top of your class from HS... only get to attend uni because you got a full scholarship... taught Science classes in Tanzania... spent time studying abroad... got selected to fly helicopters for the Army.... when you graduate that top of your class... pick a bad ass but tough airframe with a combat role... when you are IN combat.. when you survive a crash.. rebuild your life.. when you fall out of the sky and LIVE. When you have done all that, you can't help but feel in command of yourself.. you can't help but love yourself for ALL THE HARD WORK, LONG HOURS, obstacles you've overcome, and successes that have come from it... If you've done all that.. you would be confident too." She looked a little indignant and stunned. I finished by saying, "Look... you have plenty to be proud of too.. if you're asking me why I'm so confident, is it coming from a place of you feeling insecure and not confident? Loving others starts with self love.. maybe you should try it." That was early on my injury... I have always loved myself... hard not to when your parents and community teach you HOW to love yourself and the importance of WHY you should love yourself. BUT I was definitely NOT comfortable with this injury and my body post injury... I mean I will never be ok with this injury.. BUT I've learned to find joy, purpose, and meaning despite it... maybe in some ways I have to admit because of it. LEARNED A LOT OF LESSONS.. that's why it took so long to find my human (I suspect). I wasn't ready to be with someone like my fiancee because I wasn't ready to match her amazing... Before my injury I was vain (still can be a little), I was shallow, I was kind of a fuck boy. I wouldn't have deserved someone like her before my injury. I will never like this injury... but if it wasn't for this injury I would never have gained the inner strength and character that made me worthy of my partner now. I am fortunate. BUT it was a journey. Be patient as you all go through yours. rebeca is right. We ALL have our shit... leg walker or wheeler.... it's about loving yourself and finding someone you love so much that their baggage compliments your baggage.. that their baggage.. some of it anyways.. in some small ways becomes a part of their charm.. something you love them for.. because it makes them uniquely them... and when you find your human.. you love them for who they uniquely are... all of them.
|
|
spinaltap2020
New Member
Posts: 6
Gender: Male
Dev Status: Disabled Male
Relationship Status: Single
|
Post by spinaltap2020 on Jun 28, 2020 20:50:15 GMT -5
I've struggled with this since college. My disability is not what one would consider severe necessarily, but there are some things that I believe I'll always need help with (toileting, bathing, etc.). There are frequent moments that I have where I wonder if it's fair to put that on someone. I still don't know that I have an answer, but I think it's helpful to remember that an adult relationship is just that...an adult relationship. Nobody in the relationship is being forced to be there, and if they make you feel that way then that's an abusive relationship. So what it comes down to is that we shouldn't feel bad because 1. relationships are about caring for one another and 2. anyone has the freedom to leave at any time.
|
|
|
Post by Slinxter on Oct 9, 2020 15:41:34 GMT -5
It appears as I dig through the previous posts (overly-enthusiastic am I? Perhaps just funemployed?) I have things to say. I have handled more caregiving, or supervision of caregiving than you would ever suspect from looking at my profile. My father had a stroke 12 years ago, and I moved from CO to ATX specifically to move him in with me and to take care of him as long as he needs care. I was wandering amuck, and was ready to move to ATX, and I accelerated my timeline to move so I could set up all the life things (job, ADA rental house, Accessible car, job for me) to make it work. In the 12 years my Dad has lived with me, I have had more success career and finance-wise than I probably would have if I had decided I was willing to put my Dad in a retirement home.
Irony, my Mom, who he divorced 40 years ago, also lives with me (as of 3 years ago), bwahaha! Dad is paralyzed entirely on his right (previously dominant) side. If I say I can handle his needs, I'ma be pissed if you say I can't. If I cannot personally physically handle it, I have had 12 years experience hiring people to do the stuff I can't. Whether or not something I consider taking on is a burden to me is mine to decide.
I have provided care to my Dad that I never wanted to do personally, but I have also done care on myself I never wanted to do personally. Humans are messy, and sometimes kinda gross (including non-PWD, you do not want to be there when I impersonate The Exorcist when I up-chuck), and that is just part of being human.
No one would ever guess looking at me or casually talking to me that I can and have changed a bottom sheet & accoutrements for a 6'-1" 200+ lb. man without getting him out of bed, but I can. It is 100% my choice if I am willing to take that on or not.
That being said, I handle my Dad's situation with as much dignity and humor as I can, but I can imagine that it could feel like the person you want to know intimately handling your bodily functions would be very uncomfortable.
|
|
benri
New Member
Posts: 17
Gender: Male
Relationship Status: It's complicated
|
Post by benri on Oct 11, 2020 23:36:49 GMT -5
VP, just wanted to say great thread idea. I find the subject interesting particularly in regards to progressive conditions also as it's something I explore a lot in my fiction - so I appreciate the input of the guys with MDs especially (or other progressive disorders) in regard to this topic (like TGG). My perspective on it, personally, as an AB female dev, is that everyone deserves a chance to love and be loved. I would think that most people, even if you've had bad relationships and broken hearts, would agree that Shakespeare was right; "it's better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all." I think that most people would rather have a few years or even a few months with someone they love who loves them than to live many many years never knowing what love is... But then that tends to be a theme I explore in a lot of my fiction, so maybe I'm biased... "Love means never having to say you're sorry" is a catchphrase based on a line from the Erich Segal novel Love Story and was popularized by its 1970 film adaptation starring Ali MacGraw and Ryan O'Neal. Alfred Lord Tennyson Quotes 'Tis better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all.
|
|
benri
New Member
Posts: 17
Gender: Male
Relationship Status: It's complicated
|
Post by benri on Oct 11, 2020 23:55:12 GMT -5
I have a different take on it. It annoys me when someone whom I want to have a relationship with makes decisions for me without my input. This 'I'm a burden.' so I can't have a relationship with you takes away MY autonomy... where do MY choices and MY desires factor into your decision for me? If you're rejecting me because you don't feel an emotional connection or aren't attracted to me, fine, tell me the that. If you're afraid of getting hurt, or rejected, or potential relationship crash and burn... say so. But don't make decisions for me that way. I'm an adult. I know what I want and what I'm willing to deal with... do I know exactly what it will/would entail to be with random disabled dude? No, because it's always different. But by the same token, HE doesn't know what it would entail to be with me. I think that when you automatically decide that you can't have relationships because it's selfish of you or you might be a burden or whatever... you're being even MORE selfish. You're denying multiple women... or even one woman who might wind up with you... of the love that you're capable of giving. (If you're not capable of loving others or you're overwhelmingly self absorbed, ignore this.) I am six years late but, anyway, here are my two cents. Fear, lack of confidence, lack of trust on devotee, insecurity, play a role in the sense of been a burden. Honesty, respect and education should be at front. A relationship between a disabled individual and an AB Dev should be based on the mutual desire and commitment to make it work.
|
|
benri
New Member
Posts: 17
Gender: Male
Relationship Status: It's complicated
|
Post by benri on Oct 12, 2020 0:10:02 GMT -5
I think the mean problem for us disabled people is we don't want to be a burden on anyone even if we do get help from carers but do I think wanting a relationship is selfish in of it's self no before my second disability kick in later in life I was and in a way still am a very independent person that likes to do stuff myself it has taken me a very long time to be able to just let other people help me out so I can see why some people might think that having a relationship is selfish I mean no one wants to be a burden on anybody but so long as the person you are going to have a relationship knows what he or she is getting into I see no problem with a disabled person having a relationship I believe we could become a burden if the Dev is ill prepared or informed regarding our needs. Honest wilingness and True Love paired with a sincere desire can overcome the demands of a relationship with a disabled partner (us).
|
|
benri
New Member
Posts: 17
Gender: Male
Relationship Status: It's complicated
|
Post by benri on Oct 12, 2020 0:26:27 GMT -5
But while I was dating him, the things he thought were burdensome and the things that really did get to me and ultimately killed the relationship were completely different. Taking longer to do things, or not being able to go certain places, whatever, I didn't mind. Even the things that were really horrible and mortifying to him, like the time he shit his pants in public, it didn't make me love him less or want to get out of the relationship. No, what killed the relationship was his depression and suicidal tendencies that he buried under heavy drinking and took out on me. The real problem was mental, not physical. This is what happened with me and my ex 100%. Thank you so much devogirl for sharing this. I struggle with so much guilt sometimes that I should've done more, been stronger, stayed longer... etc etc. I NEVER minded the complications that came with his disability. Like you said, it never made me love him less or want to leave. It was the emotional issues that destroyed us. He was horrifically depressed, suicidal, and addicted to opiates. I was in recovery at the time, and have a history of depression. Eventually I completely burned myself out trying to fill that void inside of him. I was offering my hand out to a drowning man, and he pulled me under with him. I became depressed and suicidal, I relapsed to deal with the constant stress of trying to save him from himself. I lost myself. I wound up leaving him. If I hadn't I know without a doubt I would be dead right now. It was that bad. I also had a 4 year old daughter who was being hurt by all this. I had to save myself for my child. It ripped me open to leave. I still loved him so SO fucking much. I remember saying "If I stay, I know one morning I will wake up next to your dead body. I just can't handle that." He understood. He actually was so kind about it, just really, really sad. So, I left him. Eight months later he was dead. He had OD'd... his Dad found him the next morning... Dead in his bed. Even though logically I tell myself it had to happen this way, that you can't save someone who refuses to save himself, I have terrible guilt for abandoning him. I have recurring nightmares about him blaming me, being mad at me, or finding him dead. He never believed he "deserved" me. No matter how I tried to show him his disability didn't bother me, how I adored him, the bitterness and self-hatred just grew and grew. Every small thing he couldn't do...carry groceries, shovel snow, fix my car... it became a festering sore inside him. So, as to the topic of this thread: PWD DO deserve love, and there are people more than willing to love them in return. But, it's the PWD's inability to ACCEPT love that becomes the issue. You did your best. I would say, you did more that it should be demanded of anyone. Relationships should be based on healthy grounds. One thing is to a be a caregiver and another is to be a wheelbarrow of unhealthy emotions. One will burn the other. And there nothing anyone could do, there not any amount of effort to convince or make someone who is unable to accept the reality of someone loving them.
|
|
|
Post by robbb on Oct 15, 2020 15:55:34 GMT -5
My short answer to the OP...
Someone will only have a relationship with you if they want to. How can that be selfish?
R.
|
|
|
Post by Utahquad on Oct 15, 2020 19:11:48 GMT -5
Sometimes I cannot help but to admit that I do. I don't know how I can see it other than being selfish on my part. The way I see it is that relationships are two-way streets, and sometimes I don't feel like I can give out as much as I can take. Being a quad there’s so much to needing care for just about everything, so one can feel some burden on needing to ask for everything as it is. It's easy to just deflect and say screw it all, but at the same time yearning for something deep in my heart that I know I am missing. It's a weird feeling to have and depending on one's living situation people might not accept the way things are. Or people just simply have different life goals, then go in different directions and always get left with the feeling of what could have been rather than what they are. Life is complicated and often times more tragic and sad then we hope they turn out to be. I will never stop trying to meet people but don't know how life will roll out for me. I know there is only a few things I can control and optimism is better than pessimism, so who knows what tomorrow might bring.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2021 17:36:21 GMT -5
I understand the perspective but no, for me, it's human. I want intimacy and a relationship as much as anyone. I don't think it's on me to decide that loving me is "too hard"...although despite having numerous challenges I feel I provide value as a partner. I do my best to mitigate my limitations and dependence on others.
So no, I don't feel it's selfish or at least not anymore selfish than any other person.
|
|
alchemist
Junior Member
Posts: 80
Gender: Male
Dev Status: Disabled
Relationship Status: Single
|
Post by alchemist on Feb 21, 2021 18:20:46 GMT -5
I've got a question to those who feel like a burden to their (hypothetical) partners. Is it because you're afraid that you'd put pressure on your partner and it might become too much work for him/her or at least make him/her at times feel obligated to do something despite being tired or stressed? Or is it that you dislike the idea of your partner helping you and in a way depending on him/her, no matter if he/she would love to help? I can only speak to my experience of this, I was independent and athletic before becoming disabled, at first it was very hard to accept care. As my condition progressed I required more care and it's easy to feel like a burden at times. After having multiple caregivers it's clear that it can make you feel more like a burden when someone is a caregiver but does not enjoy it, but if they enjoy being in the caregiver role, it can be a great thing and turns in to something like team mates. Also the way people care for something changes when they care about it. An old saying goes "if someone likes a flower they pluck it, if someone loves a flower they water it daily". When you love something it doesn't feel like a chore to help care for it or help it grow. I think that generally as long as they are the type of person that is comfortable with helping provide care for someone they love, and they love/care about you, then PWDs who require a PCA shouldn't feel like a burden in a dating relationship, even though it's easy to feel that way at times especially when more care is required, for example just asking for a sip of water can feel like a burden if someone is exhausted. We all deserve care in times of need, but not everyone is capable of caring for other people in times of need. And that is fine too. It takes a special person to consistently provide a higher level of care for someone. For a long time (before finding out about devs) I never wanted a significant other to be involved with caregiving at all, I still think it would be selfish to expect that of just anyone. After seeing how some people truly enjoy helping, as long as they are ok with it all, I can see how wanting a relationship can be selfless instead of selfish, for both sides.
|
|
joe89
New Member
Single
Posts: 48
Gender: Male
Dev Status: Disabled Male
|
Post by joe89 on Feb 24, 2021 10:16:03 GMT -5
I had that feeling until not a long ago actually. Maybe sometimes I can still feel a sort of sense of guilt coming up. However, I have been working a lot on that during the last 2-3 years with a psychologist and now the most of the time I just think that although I get around on a wheelchair, I can be a very good partner for a girl, and give her even more than most of the guys out there. I am still single, it is the last sphere to recover after my accident (4 years ago), but I am quite confident it can be sorted out relatively fast 😊
|
|