Next book club

[devogirl]

Ok, the last book club discussion was a little disappointing because the story was so bad, and because it seems a Friday night was not good for most people. So among those few of us who participated in the last chat, we decided that the next selection would be The Morning Side of Dawn by Justine Davis. This is a romance novel, and rather old, about a double amputee, not a para. But we've mentioned it several times here, and many people seem interested in reading it. And we are not all para devotees here, so it's good to get some variety.

If you live in the US, you can buy a cheap used copy on Amazon:
amzn.com/0373076746
Try to overlook the terrible cover illustration.

Here it is on Amazon UK:
www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0373076746

And on Amazon Canada:
www.amazon.ca/gp/product/0373076746

If you live somewhere else, or if you don't want to buy a copy, you can download it for free here:
www.mediafire.com/download.php?tjkziv77rbdm3vc
Thanks to Devotee Journal:
devoteejournal.livejournal.com/
So if you download it, visit her page and let her know you appreciate it.

The consensus seems to be that going back to a weeknight is better. I suggest Tuesday, Feb. 22 at 8 pm EST, or Wednesday Feb. 23 at the same time. What do you think? Would either date work for you?

Also, I know 8 PM EST is not good for a lot of you. The first time around I suggested setting up a second chat at a different time, but someone else will have to set a time and open the chat, since I can't do it in the middle of the night or during the day. If any of you want to do that, please volunteer and set a time.

[ruthmadison]

Jan 30, 2011 20:24:59 GMT -5 devogirl said:

Ok, the last book club discussion was a little disappointing because the story was so bad, and because it seems a Friday night was not good for most people. So among those few of us who participated in the last chat, we decided that the next selection would be The Morning Side of Dawn by Justine Davis. This is a romance novel, and rather old, about a double amputee, not a para. But we've mentioned it several times here, and many people seem interested in reading it. And we are not all para devotees here, so it's good to get some variety.

If you live in the US, you can buy a cheap used copy on Amazon:
amzn.com/0373076746
Try to overlook the terrible cover illustration.

Here it is on Amazon UK:
www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0373076746

And on Amazon Canada:
www.amazon.ca/gp/product/0373076746

If you live somewhere else, or if you don't want to buy a copy, you can download it for free here:
www.mediafire.com/download.php?tjkziv77rbdm3vc
Thanks to Devotee Journal:
devoteejournal.livejournal.com/
So if you download it, visit her page and let her know you appreciate it.

The consensus seems to be that going back to a weeknight is better. I suggest Tuesday, Feb. 22 at 8 pm EST, or Wednesday Feb. 23 at the same time. What do you think? Would either date work for you?

Also, I know 8 PM EST is not good for a lot of you. The first time around I suggested setting up a second chat at a different time, but someone else will have to set a time and open the chat, since I can't do it in the middle of the night or during the day. If any of you want to do that, please volunteer and set a time.

Tuesday would work well for me

[devogirl]

Did I? To be honest, I wrote that review over a year after I read it, kind of as a place holder. Now even more time has passed since I read it, and as I recall, while it's not the best book ever, still it does have some good devo scenes. I guess that's a mediocre review, but I still think it's a fun read. At least better than that Avatar fanfic. Anyway to be clear it was Emma who suggested it and other people have mentioned that they have bought it or downloaded it recently, so it seemed like a good choice.

Anyway Annabelle I hope you join us!

[Emma]

I can do either day that week at 8pm EST. I'm of to start reading.

[dolly]

i definitely cannot do tuesday the 22nd. i have tickets for a show. wednesday the 23rd at 8pm would work great.

[Emma]

For those who are wavering about reading the book.....I started it last night and really enjoyed it. I stayed up way later than I had planned because I didn't want to put it down. It's DEFINITELY better than the Avatar fan fiction last month. A quote: "People can be awful, whether they stare at you or through you...He never would have expected her to understand something like that."

[ruthmadison]

I agree with Emma, I'm enjoying the book a lot so far. I'm about a third of the way in and I don't find the girl character to be annoying at all. I think the book has a lot of elements of romance novels that I don't care for, but for its genre it's well done and an enjoyable read. So far, anyway.

[~Z28gal~]

Hey ladies!
I'd love to be in on the next discussion, and either day works for me.

[Emma]

z28 and Annabelle it would be great to have you two join us! I hope to hear a few other new voices in February.

[Emma]

I've been doing some internet stalking again.

Justine Davis on Morning Side of Dawn in June 2003:
"MSOD was indeed a very special book. It was also one of the hardest I've ever written. When I realized Dar wasn't going to just go away and leave me alone, I was terrified, for fear I would somehow mess it up, not do it justice, or hurt someone. I spent many an hour asking myself where I got off thinking I could or should write this!I also had some wonderful help in the form of people on a now sadly defunct disabilities online bulletin board, people who taught me some valuable lessons. I especially remember one of them, who said, so very wisely, “If you think making love is only the actual sex act, then your problem isn’t your body, it’s your head.” As I said in the dedication, if this story reached you, it was their doing."

from her discussion board www.justinedare.com/cgibin/dcforum/dcboard.cgi

[ruthmadison]

Feb 1, 2011 0:36:34 GMT -5 Emma said:

I've been doing some internet stalking again.

Justine Davis on Morning Side of Dawn in June 2003:
"MSOD was indeed a very special book. It was also one of the hardest I've ever written. When I realized Dar wasn't going to just go away and leave me alone, I was terrified, for fear I would somehow mess it up, not do it justice, or hurt someone. I spent many an hour asking myself where I got off thinking I could or should write this!I also had some wonderful help in the form of people on a now sadly defunct disabilities online bulletin board, people who taught me some valuable lessons. I especially remember one of them, who said, so very wisely, “If you think making love is only the actual sex act, then your problem isn’t your body, it’s your head.” As I said in the dedication, if this story reached you, it was their doing."

from her discussion board www.justinedare.com/cgibin/dcforum/dcboard.cgi

That's quite an interesting question and one I have also faced. Do we have the right to write about things that are not our own struggles? Do we have the right to have opinions about these things?

I wrote a little bit about that issue heredisabilityandmedia.blogspot.com/2011/01/so-much-for-my-career.html but it is a complex topic.

The thing is, whenever one writes a story or a book, there are going to be characters who have experiences we haven't had. "Write what you know" is a fine adage, but even if you write your own story, you'll have the characters of the people around you, whose thoughts you really don't know.

Women have to write from a male's perspective and vice versa. We have to find and understand the motivation of people different from us and we have to figure out how to use our life experiences to extrapolate how other life experiences might feel.

It is an issue in every kind of writing, not just those of us writing about disability. Does a Jew have the right to tell the story of a Muslim? Does a white man have the right to tell the story of a Japanese woman (Memoirs of a Geisha. He did it extraordinarily well!)?

Very, very interesting topic...

[ruthmadison]

Feb 1, 2011 10:00:27 GMT -5 annabelle said:

I think a skilled writer can write about something they haven't personally experienced, as long as they make the effort to research it well, and find their own way to relate to it. Like if one of us researched, say, foot fetish and wrote a book about someone with a foot fetish, we could use our own feelings about being devotees as motivation.

For a less skilled writer with less time to research, it's probably harder to do that. So it's better to stick to what we know.

But I think the main problem with a non-dev writing a book that's a romance about a disabled guy is this:

--Devs aren't going to like it because they're probably not going "get" what we like about wheelers and that's something that's hard to research

--Non-devs probably aren't going to like it because I don't think they fantasize about f*cking a guy in his chair like we do

So it's kind of lose-lose.

So true, research is great, but it can only go so far. On the other hand, I think everyone has a full range of human feeling inside of them, if they can just tap into it.

When I wrote my book my mom said, everyone is going to know this is about you. I assured her it was fiction, but the truth is that other devs who have read it know that I had to be because who else would understand those feelings? Could a non-dev ever write realistically about those things? I rather doubt it.

I'm almost finished the book and there's one part that stung for me. It doesn't spoil anything, so I'll say that at one point two girls are talking:
"So, you're having a problem convincing Dar you don't care that he's in a chair?"
Cassie twisted around to look at Rory directly. "Was that a trick question? Of course I care. I'd much rather he wasn't, but he is."

That's what romance novels with disabled characters amount to. I bought a pile of used romances of this type and I'm finding them pretty disappointing because as you say, the writers miss the point, don't get what parts are appealing.

I think I have a lot of work ahead of me balancing those stories with ones where the girl loves that he's in a chair!

(Of course, that does touch a nerve, the fear of what it says about me that I don't wish the person wasn't. I haven't reconciled that in myself yet, I don't know if I ever will. That's the one piece of this that makes me feel inhuman).

[ruthmadison]

I'm doing both at the moment. I want there to be some stories out there with dev leads, but I also enjoy writing stories where they just happen to fall in love.

For the book that Lee is putting out, I submitted a story that's unclear, it never specifies whether the girl is a dev or not, but she acts like it.

I don't think I've read your stories yet, I'll have to get over to the fiction section and check them out today! I've really enjoyed the couple of stories I've read so far over there.

[~Z28gal~]

Feb 1, 2011 10:13:43 GMT -5 ruthmadison said:

(Of course, that does touch a nerve, the fear of what it says about me that I don't wish the person wasn't. I haven't reconciled that in myself yet, I don't know if I ever will. That's the one piece of this that makes me feel inhuman).

That's a really tough thing to deal with. I know, for me, that while I don't wish the guy was AB for my sake, I CAN wish the guy was AB for his sake. If there was a "cure" available for a wheeler I was involved in, I'd be excited for him, and if I hear about a guy getting an SCI, it earns a not a ;D.

Honestly, I think we have it better than the general population in terms of dealing with a disability in our significant other. NOT wishing their guy is AB is the strongest form of acceptance non-devs can have, and we've got that down pat. I don't think that makes devs... "sick" for lack of a better word. None of the devs I know would WISH an injury on someone, we're just there for afterwards.

I'm not nearly as clear of a writer as you are, Ruth, I hope some of that made sense!

[ruthmadison]

Feb 1, 2011 14:13:29 GMT -5 ~Z28gal~ said:

Feb 1, 2011 10:13:43 GMT -5 ruthmadison said:

(Of course, that does touch a nerve, the fear of what it says about me that I don't wish the person wasn't. I haven't reconciled that in myself yet, I don't know if I ever will. That's the one piece of this that makes me feel inhuman).

That's a really tough thing to deal with. I know, for me, that while I don't wish the guy was AB for my sake, I CAN wish the guy was AB for his sake. If there was a "cure" available for a wheeler I was involved in, I'd be excited for him, and if I hear about a guy getting an SCI, it earns a not a ;D.

Honestly, I think we have it better than the general population in terms of dealing with a disability in our significant other. NOT wishing their guy is AB is the strongest form of acceptance non-devs can have, and we've got that down pat. I don't think that makes devs... "sick" for lack of a better word. None of the devs I know would WISH an injury on someone, we're just there for afterwards.

I'm not nearly as clear of a writer as you are, Ruth, I hope some of that made sense!

Exactly! And that's the happy side of it, but I have to admit I worry that if I was involved with someone and there was a cure at some point, what that would do to our sex life!

It's scary and hard to say, but it is a concern for me. If I loved someone, of course I would support whatever would make him happy, but it would be a real struggle if I had to deal with someone becoming able-bodied!

I guess you're absolutely right that it really does mirror the struggle of the other direction, of women having to hold onto their love when a man they are with sustains a disabling injury.