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Post by matisse on Jul 30, 2017 15:26:39 GMT -5
newjess, because they both relate to superiority. If she's insulting me to make herself feel superior, then an equivalent insult back is to make her feel inferior.
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Post by darthoso on Jul 30, 2017 15:28:04 GMT -5
She wasn't the best so it's overall good that we're parting ways (though replacing her has been a nightmare). Half my income goes to BCBS, the other half supplementing my aides. Her situation doesn't anger me, she's in her 60s, terrible health, divorced, in Section 8 housing with her sister, has a string of DUIs on her record. What frustrates me is I've currently got a choice, my Dad retires as of Monday, making me SSDI DAC eligible. Right now I'm 1619b so I only get Medicaid (and the waiver), but if I reduce my hours to get my pre tax income below the SGA, I can double my income and get Medicare in two years (bye BCBS, especially since they aren't covering Spinraza), plus keep Medicaid under my State's buy in. Downside is I have to turn down every incremental raise for life. Wait too long and I lose DAC by having too many work credits (non DAC SSDI could disqualify you from Medicaid in NC). It's also an open question if the NC Medicaid buy in applies to the waiver or if the waiver has the same asset limit as SSI ($2k). That pisses me off. That sounds insanely complex Lil bit
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Post by lucretia on Jul 30, 2017 15:30:49 GMT -5
Oh, by the way, I got this snazzy new job, and for the first time since my last divorce (11 years) I am no longer using any of your taxes, matisse . LOL I'm finally able to eat my Cheetos without guilt!! 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
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Post by newjess on Jul 30, 2017 15:38:02 GMT -5
newjess, because they both relate to superiority. If she's insulting me to make herself feel superior, then an equivalent insult back is to make her feel inferior. Lol meh... Still think insulting her occupation in order to make her feel inferior to you implies that you do actually think her occupation makes her inferior to you. I just don't see how that's any different than thinking the fact that she's AB makes her superior to you (the very thing you are insulting her for). You asked how we would do it: I wouldn't insult her race, sexual orientation, occupation, education level, gender/gender identity, etc etc. I would and have asked people why they think they are somehow surperior to PWDs and then gone on to explain to them why they are mistaken and how they are being ableist.
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Post by matisse on Jul 30, 2017 17:17:32 GMT -5
I would and have asked people why they think they are somehow surperior to PWDs and then gone on to explain to them why they are mistaken and how they are being ableist. Well that's not an insult, that's being nice and trying to teach her something. How would you insult her? Lol meh... Still think insulting her occupation in order to make her feel inferior to you implies that you do actually think her occupation makes her inferior to you. It's a reasonable conclusion but not a necessary one. People insult each other by saying things they don't believe, all the time. But regardless, it's what she believes, not me. If she believes being a receptionist is inherently inferior, then I have successfully insulted her (LOL) whether or not I believe all receptionists are inferior. You don't need to look any further than my own Dad. He toiled away for crappy pay as a technician without even a high school degree. My Mom told us after he died that he intensely hated his job because they treated him like crap. But he felt he could not risk leaving the job. As kids we never knew that he hated it. If a technician insults me and I insult them hack by insinuating that a technician is an inferior job, does that mean I consider all people who are technicians with no high school degree inferior to me? Absolutely not. My Dad was a better person than me. In fact, I am now a spoiled, whiny, selfish brat by comparison, who isn't even willing to try to be as good a man as he was. The same with a receptionist. How could I not have the utmost respect for a receptionist who overcame all sorts of shit to find a good regular job? On the other hand, for a cheeto-eating couch potato receptionist who pays no taxes and thinks she's support me, I have no respect and am going to hit her where I think she will feel it.
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Post by darthoso on Jul 30, 2017 18:24:09 GMT -5
Somewhat related, a receptionist is more likely to be bothered by those on Disability than someone with a higher income job. Your average joe on Disability is probably making close to what a receptionist makes, without working. I saw a Dental Hygienist who praise me for the entire cleaning about how great it was I had a degree and was trying to work. So much so that she said it again to my Dad a week later and my neighbor who she recognized the street address ("do you know Jon??"). I'm 99.9% I was inspiration porn to her proving in her mind most people on Disability were lazy and just don't want to work. Again I don't know what a Dental Hygienist makes in Rural NC, but I doubt it's much more than SSDI. That resentment is real.
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Post by Corey on Jul 30, 2017 19:59:14 GMT -5
It sounds to me like Matisse just wants to get underneath the skin of someone he feels has wronged him. I can get behind that, but how do you know if the woman really feels superior to you, or if she just doesnt have experience knowing disabled people who work?
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Post by newjess on Jul 30, 2017 20:22:15 GMT -5
matisse I can actually see what you mean. You don't necessarily have to believe that a receptionist is inferior to you to deduce that making an insult like that could potentially hit her where it hurts. I appreciated your story about your dad, thank you for sharing that. It's similar to mine, and I can see what you mean about not necessarily thinking they are inferior but knowing you could use that as a jab. I know for sure my dad felt inferior in some ways because he never got a higher education, and while I don't think that makes him inferior, I DO know it would hurt if I used that as an insult. And of course that doesn't necessarily mean that every person without higher education/those in more "blue collar" jobs/etc feels inferior! They may feel totally fine about it, so like you said that jab might not hit them as hard. I think my dad was insecure about it because it was more of a failure thing FOR HIM (not in general). So that leads me to where I agree with @tc123 that we're just not the type who would use those sorts of insults. I agree that if I was duking it out with someone I would make comments on the actions/words that directly pissed me off, instead of taking jabs at indirect things like socioeconomic status. I also just don't really use insults much, but that's because I always feel REALLY bad if I was mean to someone. But that doesn't mean I just back down. I'm obviously very vocal and stand up for things, I just try to do it in a way that gives the other person a chance to be better rather than closing them off OR allows me to learn something (maybe I realize I'm the one that's actually being an asshole, etc). I just find that attacks and insults lead to a bigger divide and not much positive change.
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Post by matisse on Jul 30, 2017 21:18:58 GMT -5
matisse , its apparent that you do think being a receptionist is inferior to you, or you wouldn't have used it as an insult. It's unfortunate you have come to this conclusion about me. Is there any way for me to change your mind? Though I'm not sure I have anything to add that I haven't already said.
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Post by matisse on Jul 30, 2017 21:23:15 GMT -5
It sounds to me like Matisse just wants to get underneath the skin of someone he feels has wronged him. That is correct. I can get behind that, but how do you know if the woman really feels superior to you, or if she just doesnt have experience knowing disabled people who work? There's no way to be sure, of course. I think most people just get a sense of whether there is an insult intended (by anyone for anything), even as to identical language being used.
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Post by matisse on Jul 30, 2017 22:11:39 GMT -5
So that leads me to where I agree with @tc123 that we're just not the type who would use those sorts of insults. I agree that if I was duking it out with someone I would make comments on the actions/words that directly pissed me off, instead of taking jabs at indirect things like socioeconomic status. I also just don't really use insults much, but that's because I always feel REALLY bad if I was mean to someone. But that doesn't mean I just back down. I'm obviously very vocal and stand up for things, I just try to do it in a way that gives the other person a chance to be better rather than closing them off OR allows me to learn something (maybe I realize I'm the one that's actually being an asshole, etc). I just find that attacks and insults lead to a bigger divide and not much positive change. Well again it doesn't seem like you are insulting them back, so I don't think you can make the comparison because I do intent to insult them back and intend for them to feel insulted. There's no rule for insults, they don't need to highly correlate, but here they do anyway. She's insulting my socioeconomic status by calling me a deadbeat moocher, and she's getting that thrown back in her face. While it might make me an asshole based on the discussion here, in real life I would come across as so much more of an asshole if I just said "fuck you." The same thing for your approach: if she insults you in this indirect way and you start making a big fuss to make her see the error of her ways, you're the one who's going to look like the asshole. That's not really fair since she's the one who did the insulting and you're not even trying to get even. I could say something a long the lines of what I have described with some encouragement and smile and be on my way without causing any ruckus but still letting her have it. I agree that trading insults leads to nowhere and can result in a greater divide. It's also the case that negative pressure can make a person think twice the next time before doing the same thing, that's just human nature. As for me, if someone's insulting me I'm going with the negative pressure.
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Post by newjess on Jul 30, 2017 22:41:46 GMT -5
matisse I see what you mean, and if I'm being honest if someone is blatantly an asshole to me or makes some unprovoked remark, etc... Then yeah I can get pretty sassy. Usually my approach is more along the "excuse me???" plus this face: I don't get to this point very often though. You have to be pretty aggressive/disrespectful towards me to push me to the level where I'm full on Ice Cube face. The last time I think I got to that point in public was a guy coming at me at the dog park and basically saying my dog was bullying his dog and I wasn't paying attention, yada yada. I got real sassy/mad and argued with him, but no insults. Sadly I'm really sensitive so when things get heated I always end up holding back tears. Angry tears. Then when I'm away from the situation I cry really hard lol. Probably why I don't get into these situations much. Yeah I guess I just don't use insults much. I'll more just argue with them, and yes you're right that can turn into a situation where you end up looking like the asshole. Happened to me at an oil change place, they did my inspection but ran it on the wrong VIN number. So I went back and one of the guys basically said I was lying even though I was like... Dude just look in the system and you'll see. He refused to look and was super aggressive with me, I got sassy and was arguing with him, one dude threatened to kick me out, then all of a sudden this other dude looked in the system and realized I was right. He felt so bad but by that point I was balling my eyes out and just got in my car and left. So yeah I don't do well when things get to that point so I usually just try not to go there lol.Â
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Post by newjess on Jul 30, 2017 22:57:55 GMT -5
To the OP... In my short amount of time dating in the PWD world and witnessing these sorts of comments (one year now for me), so far they've usually been more on the "dumb" side rather than the insulting side (like, they're just ignorant/naive/unaware). That's not to say it doesn't happen of course, I just haven't been in that situation. If I was with Tek and someone said something insulting in relation to disability (or anything lol), I'd probably try REALLY hard to let him deal with it because he's way more calm than I am lol.
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Post by AlrightyAphrodite on Jul 31, 2017 1:59:18 GMT -5
Oh, by the way, I got this snazzy new job, and for the first time since my last divorce (11 years) I am no longer using any of your taxes, matisse . LOL I'm finally able to eat my Cheetos without guilt!! 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 Every time I drive down an interstate highway, I say to myself..."Thanks Matisse".
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Post by vegmama on Jul 31, 2017 12:17:45 GMT -5
To the OP... In my short amount of time dating in the PWD world and witnessing these sorts of comments (one year now for me), so far they've usually been more on the "dumb" side rather than the insulting side (like, they're just ignorant/naive/unaware). That's not to say it doesn't happen of course, I just haven't been in that situation. If I was with Tek and someone said something insulting in relation to disability (or anything lol), I'd probably try REALLY hard to let him deal with it because he's way more calm than I am lol. Yep, same here! More ignorance than nastiness. From everything you've said on this post, you sound very much like me in how we deal (or don't deal) with conflict. Like I said before, I'd rather just avoid if possible. I'm not a pushover but I also don't want to sink to other people's level. And many times it falls on deaf ears or closed minds anyway. I also get flustered and think of such great things to say AFTER the fact! You make a good point about letting our guys take the lead in handling things...not only because you and I are less eloquent (lol) at dealing with conflict, but also because if significant others in general jump in first, we run the risk of showing that our bf's can't stick up for themselves. You're already dealing with someone who has some sort of stereotype or ignorance of PWD's. Better to not reinforce anymore misconceptions. Backing up or supporting our guys: for sure. But I think it makes a better impact for them to act first.
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