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Post by myrrh on Sept 23, 2020 14:32:32 GMT -5
We can ignore the fact the problem on PD exists, we can pretend that everything is all roses and just continue in the same manner. Or... We can acknowledge there is a problem, identify it and agree that we want to work on solving it, all together. If we want to make society better, we might as well start from making our small community better. One step at a time. I invite you to re-read my post and find that I did, in fact, cite it as a problem that deserves further attention. I can make a separate thread for it later if you're unable to refrain from pushing the topic further here.
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Post by Amee on Sept 23, 2020 14:39:21 GMT -5
Braced4Impact sorry for derailing your thread! myrrh I'm not going to start a separate thread, but if you do, I'm fairly certain I'll participate and I look forward to some respectful disagreement about who should be respectfully and disrespectfully disagreed with (All right, I'll shut up now.)
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Post by Braced4Impact on Sept 23, 2020 14:39:49 GMT -5
No worries, it was just a simple vent post. I never thought it would get past the first page in replies, TBH.
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Post by Corey on Sept 23, 2020 14:53:00 GMT -5
Guys. It became a teachable moment on what it means to be an ally, ableism, and the work we can do to be more inclusive of PWD as a society. Well, that’s one way of describing what happened...
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Post by Amee on Sept 23, 2020 14:54:20 GMT -5
I'm sure you didn't mean it that way, but to imply that assuming that someone has a mental disability is somehow as offensive as assuming someone is a Nazi seems a little off to me. I mean, being a Nazi is clearly a horrible thing. But should having a mental disability really be such a horrible thing? Just a random thought that popped into my head, but what's so offensive about a mental disability anyway? Doesn't that also say quite a bit about how we view mental disabilities? Not that I don't understand how it can be annoying, if people assume you have a mental disability, when you don't. But just a thought... While I have nothing against people with mental disabilities, having lived through high school and being on the same bus as those who did have mental disabilities, and having to have a chip on my shoulder to prove I didn't by association to my fellow classmates, the question did get under my skin. I don't mean to brag, but I have an IQ of over 135, two college degrees plus two additional college certifications, have published numerous books and even competed on my high school competitive trivia team, I don't like having my physical disability associated with mental. Again, I hold no ill-will against those who do have mental disabilities, but I think it has to do with proper categorization. It would be like assuming a person is a transvestite if they're gay, or some other baseless association. Oh, and to bring the conversation back on topic: I hadn't reacted to that yet. Thanks for elaborating on that, it made me understand something that I had overlooked in the random thought that popped into my head. Do you think it would be fair to say that the frustration/offence is less about just wrong categorization, but rather chronically being underestimated and considered less capable because of a disability?
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Post by Braced4Impact on Sept 23, 2020 15:03:02 GMT -5
While I have nothing against people with mental disabilities, having lived through high school and being on the same bus as those who did have mental disabilities, and having to have a chip on my shoulder to prove I didn't by association to my fellow classmates, the question did get under my skin. I don't mean to brag, but I have an IQ of over 135, two college degrees plus two additional college certifications, have published numerous books and even competed on my high school competitive trivia team, I don't like having my physical disability associated with mental. Again, I hold no ill-will against those who do have mental disabilities, but I think it has to do with proper categorization. It would be like assuming a person is a transvestite if they're gay, or some other baseless association. Oh, and to bring the conversation back on topic: I hadn't reacted to that yet. Thanks for elaborating on that, it made me understand something that I had overlooked in the random thought that popped into my head. Do you think it would be fair to say that the frustration/offence is less about just wrong categorization, but rather chronically being underestimated and considered less capable because of a disability? A combination of both. I hate having to brag, it goes against my personality, but I feel I often have to, just in order to be taken seriously. I remember as a kid having waiters and waitresses asking my parents what I'll have when I was more than capable of ordering on my own (by kid, I mean up to as a teenager.) I dislike having people assume I'm less intelligent from my physical disability than I am. I understand there are indeed people with both physical and mental disabilities at the same time, but I am not one of them. It would be no different than assuming something about a race, religion, ethnicity or any other plethora of categories. Assumptions are the mother of all fuckups.
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Post by infinatedreams on Sept 23, 2020 15:29:44 GMT -5
oh the old 'so madam what does he want to eat' resteraunt scenario. it pisses me off and i find it insulting. its happened a couple of times and before ive ever been able to say something clever n smart 'she' has usually had a full blown meltdown and done the 'why dont you ask him fuckwit' then we leave ... women eh 🤦🏼♂️🤷♂️🤷♂️
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Post by ContingentlyComposite on Sept 24, 2020 11:36:42 GMT -5
Guys! I was busy all day yesterday and couldn't post, but late into the wee hours of the morning last night I was preparing a treatise in my (slightly intoxicated) mind on the nature of constructive discourse in the context of a deeply polarized society failing miserably to serve both its marginalized and non-marginalized members along a variety of dimensions, and how that interacts with pain, moral outrage, and the peculiar benefits and harms of that kind of outrage, and how all these things complicate internet spaces like this one where we seek to provide a supportive environment that represents the interest of the both the dev and PWD community while working out the truth on complicated topics through constructive discussion, and how the aims of this community will inevitably not only permit, but in some sense require, norms of discourse that are sometimes in tension, which will lead to responses that are deeply at odds with each other, serving some aims and norms of the board while violating others, and which are sometimes harmful, and how all that's really ok, and that while things could be better on PD, all things considered we're really not doing that bad when we zoom out and consider how freaking difficult it is do this kind of message board well.
I promised myself I would just share that I'm a little disappointed that the opportunity to give my speech on this thread has passed, without actually giving it, with just a few sentences. I don't know if I've succeeded...
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Post by Amee on Sept 24, 2020 11:45:16 GMT -5
Guys! I was busy all day yesterday and couldn't post, but late into the wee hours of the morning last night I was preparing a treatise in my (slightly intoxicated) mind on the nature of constructive discourse in the context of a deeply polarized society failing miserably to serve both its marginalized and non-marginalized members along a variety of dimensions, and how that interacts with pain, moral outrage, and the peculiar benefits and harms of that kind of outrage, and how all these things complicate internet spaces like this one where we seek to provide a supportive environment that represents the interest of the both the dev and PWD community while working out the truth on complicated topics through constructive discussion, and how the aims of this community will inevitably not only permit, but in some sense require, norms of discourse that are sometimes in tension, which will lead to responses that are deeply at odds with each other, serving some aims and norms of the board while violating others, and which are sometimes harmful, and how all that's really ok, and that while things could be better on PD, all things considered we're really not doing that bad when we zoom out and consider how freaking difficult it is do this kind of message board well. I promised myself I would just share that I'm a little disappointed that the opportunity to give my speech on this thread has passed, without actually giving it, with just a few sentences. I don't know if I've succeeded... I think you should start that separate thread Myrrh has suggested! (I mean, your job pretty much makes you the perfect person to do so, right? )
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